Navigation Bars [Archive] - SEO Best Practices Search Engine Forums

JGIRL

16-05-2003, 09:14/09:14AM

What software or places you would go to build navigation bars. I tried a search on this web site to learn to read about them.

What are the no-no's of a bar, what are some suggestions on building one. I will try some other searches on the internet to learn as well. (OR if some can help me build one) This is my main focus right now. I also need suggestions on what to look for when building one. Thanks

ihelpyou

16-05-2003, 09:56/09:56AM

Give 100 bucks or so to someone to build it for you. No use in doing something like that yourself when you have no experience. You may as well do things right the first time JGIRL. You will simply have to do it again later if you don't.

You are 'selling' stuff online to what you say are higher class people. They will not buy from you if the site does not look "Professional". I know you are trying to do things yourself and that is great, but graphics are something people like myself simply cannot do. Nor care to do.

JGIRL

17-05-2003, 15:53/03:53PM

I would like clarification on what a navigation bar is.
I have buttons that I just found out about in my program, so I enabled them and installed them.

They are on my site and being uploaded now. Is that what they are? Just buttons? If so I got that taken care of.

A few things that I feel I have to get straight. This web site I am taking great pride in doing myself. It is something that I always wanted to do and that is why I am taking the priveledge in doing this.

I came from a no can do family and so I was banned from doing alot of things I should have been able to at least try. So when people say not to do it or I can't/ shouldn't or whatever, I turn into a stubborn nose and do it anyway.
(One great example was riding a motorcycle, I have my license and a Kawi now and it is one of my great joy and freedom in life)

I know it is easier just to hire someone to do things, but I rather do it the hardway and at least try it. I know what my limitations are and I will turn it over to someone professional, if I know I am really out of the water. But so far I am happy just learning things.

One example is: I have accountants, lawyers. Once I get this site in order, I will be wanting to hire someone to copywrite it. I have no desire in doing something like that. So that I will be wanting someone to do for me.

As for spending money:
I will spend the money to learn how to do it myself, rather than pay for someone to do it for me. I am stubborn that way, but I plan on building other web sites as well and I have great plans for other things as well. Might as well learn the first time :-)) It may take over 6 months to get something right, but knowing that when I do get it right, it is a huge accomplishment and I take great pride in something like that. Plus, I know how to do it again, if I have too do it again.

I am a learning and hands on person. I will learn first myself even if I have to take classes to learn something.

:-)) This world is a wondeful place and for me, it is a honor to learn something new.

I appreciate all comments and help while I improve my site, and I do take them seriously and will change them no problem.

bragadocchio

17-05-2003, 16:29/04:29PM

Hi JGirl,

I know exactly where you're coming from. I can be stubborn like you, too. And it feels great when you succeed.

If you want to know how to put together a navigation bar, your best bet might be to start looking at some of the different html and graphics tutorials on the web. There are a great amount of them all over. Find one that starts with simple examples, and lets you work along.

A navigation bar is just a number of links gathered together in a table or some other grouping. The links can be text links, or image links. You can use cascading style sheets (css) for some really neat effects, too. If you haven't started using css yet, don't worry - you'll get to it, and learn how to use them.

Sometimes the difficult part isn't building a navigation bar as much as it is deciding which pages to link to from it, and what text to use in it. You'll learn how to build one quickly enough. You'll struggle with that other part for a long time after, just like everyone else.

I also learned a lot about building web pages from using the "view source" function on my browsers, and seeing what html people used to build different parts of sites. Find some fairly simple sites to begin with, and take a look. It's a good way to learn, along with using tutorials.

I use notepad rather than an html editing program. It sounds like you're working with one of those. While I'd recommend that you learn how to build pages with a simple text editing program at first, it is hard to do that. An html editing program like frontpage or dreamweaver can make a lot of web design tasks easier. There are some drawbacks to them, too. But, see if you can find some tutorials on the program that you're using -- do a search in Google or the search engine of your choice for the name of the program and the word tutorial. Chances are really good that you'll come up with more than a couple.

You can do it. :)

As you're building your sites, don't be afraid to ask others to look over them. Ask them for constructive criticism. Don't take what they say personally (and keep in mind that some people aren't good at constructive criticism). Test how well people can find things on your site while you're looking over their shoulders watching. See if they have difficulties finding stuff on the site.

Stubbornness and patience can be virtues when it comes to this stuff. Keep on learning something new each day. It doesn't have to be a lot, but it does all add up in the end.

JGIRL

17-05-2003, 16:52/04:52PM

Thanks Bill,

As a matter of fact I used a tutorial and a graphics free web site to which I really wanted to play around with the flash navigations, but I think that would overrun my web site. I used a simple navigation to which it is now on my site now. It was simple HTML and yes notepad is wonderful since I keep all of my HTML codes there for easy retrieval and new uses.

From the other pages one of the members suggested using
http://http://www.w3schools.com/
and That has been wondeful since They also suggested the CSS sheets. I never heard of them till now So I am using and going through the school.com to learn how to use the CSS sheets.
Plus I found this web site for my navigation bars and I am playing with the flash navigations and playing with other things there as well.

I have found this to be a fun graphical web site to play with, they even give you the html codes that you need to upload it on your site!!

Yes, my stubbornness and my attitude towards learning has proven very benificial to certain pay offs and this web site will be one of them once I get it to where it needs to be. :-))
Right now learning the CSS sheets are fun since I am brushing up on my HTML coding.
This was the graphic web site:

http://http://www.guistuff.com/

Here is my web site again since I can not remember if I put it in the original list
http://www.bookncrafts.com

bragadocchio

17-05-2003, 17:12/05:12PM

Great to hear!

The guistuff page is pretty neat. I hadn't been there before -- I'll have to spend some time exploring. :)

The w3schools tutorials are pretty good.

And, you do have a navigation bar on your site!

One of the things that I think you'll want to aim at is to learn how to simplify some of the code on your site. As you spend some time with the w3schools, you'll see how to do that. Using the CSS will let you do it even more.

I think that you're right about flash with your navigation right now. It might be a little too much.

I hadn't seen the other thread when I responded to this one, but it looks like you're making great progress. Keep it up!

There's a lot to learn, but it's worth doing.

JGIRL

17-05-2003, 22:51/10:51PM

Thank you very much! It helps to konk heads together with better and professional people that know what they are doing. Without everone's help I would not have gotten this far or even close to.

With everyones suggestions, help and advice I am able to do something with my site and turn it into something else. I just wish I took a before and after picture ya know, just like a remodling home show. :-)) But I guess that will happen later to the best improved sites haaaaaaaa.

One of the things that I think you'll want to aim at is to learn how to simplify some of the code on your site
I am not sure what you mean by that. if you can go into more detail for me I will learn how to make it more simple :-)) Thanks

bragadocchio

18-05-2003, 01:00/01:00AM

I am not sure what you mean by that. if you can go into more detail for me I will learn how to make it more simple :-)) Thanks
Not a problem.
I'm going to take your footer text as an example. I'll show you the way it is now. Then again, after I simplify it a little. And then, I'll show you how I might apply CSS.

Why cut down on the html on your page?
It's less complicated, and easier to work upon.
The pages will load faster in someone's browser.
Less typing, and less work.
There's a good chance that search engines like pages where they don't have to wade through as much html to get to actual text.
Your present footer:

<A
href="about.html">About Us</A> | <A
href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/search.asp">Search</A> | <A href="contact.html">Contact Us</A> | <A
href="sitemap.html">Site Map</A> | <A href="E-Letters.html">E-Letters</A> | <A
href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/showDept.asp">Online Store</A> | <A href="CRAFTERSINFORMATION.html">CRAFTERS INFORMATION</A> | <A href="Privacy.html">Privacy</A> | <A
href="LINKPAGE.html">LINK PAGE</A> | <A href="StorePolicies.html">Store Policies</A> | <A
href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/Search2.asp">Search </A> | <A href="PAYPAL.html">PAYPAL</A> | <A
href="FAQ.html">FAQ</A> | <A href="ChatForum.html">Chat Forum</A>

The footer simplified a little:



<A href="about.html">About Us</A> | 
<A href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/search.asp">Search</A> | 
<A href="contact.html">Contact Us</A> | 
<A href="sitemap.html">Site Map</A> | 
<A href="E-Letters.html">E-Letters</A> | 
<A href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/showDept.asp">Online Store</A> | 
<A href="CRAFTERSINFORMATION.html">CRAFTERS INFORMATION</A> | 
<A href="Privacy.html">Privacy</A> | 
<A href="LINKPAGE.html">LINK PAGE</A> | 
<A href="StorePolicies.html">Store Policies</A> | 
<A href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/Search2.asp">Search</A> | 
<A href="PAYPAL.html">PAYPAL</A> | 
<A href="FAQ.html">FAQ</A> | <A href="ChatForum.html">Chat Forum</A>



Instead of having every hypertext reference anchor (a href) surrounded by it's own font tag, I just have one surrounding all of those links in the footer. Anchors are allowed inbetween font tags according to html, so I was able to cut out a lot of extra font tags that weren't needed. It's simpler, and easier.

Now, I can do something similar with CSS (another tutorial for you at: http://hotwired.lycos.com/webmonkey/authoring/stylesheets/tutorials/tutorial1.html )

I could put the following in the head section of the page:

<STYLE TYPE="text/css">

</STYLE>

And then were the footer goes I would have this:


<div class="footer">
<A href="about.html">About Us</A> | 
<A href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/search.asp">Search</A> | 
<A href="contact.html">Contact Us</A> | 
<A href="sitemap.html">Site Map</A> | 
<A href="E-Letters.html">E-Letters</A> | 
<A href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/showDept.asp">Online Store</A> | 
<A href="CRAFTERSINFORMATION.html">CRAFTERS INFORMATION</A> | 
<A href="Privacy.html">Privacy</A> | 
<A href="LINKPAGE.html">LINK PAGE</A> | 
<A href="StorePolicies.html">Store Policies</A> | 
<A href="https://secure7.websitecomplete.com/jgirl57/shop/Search2.asp">Search</A> | 
<A href="PAYPAL.html">PAYPAL</A> | 
<A href="FAQ.html">FAQ</A> | <A href="ChatForum.html">Chat Forum</A>
</div>


Now, it's possible to have the information that I put in the header section of the page in a separate CSS file that is linked to by every page on your site. The tutorial I pointed towards explains how to do that.

The reason why you would want to use a separate page is that if you wanted to make a change to how your footer looked -- for instance you wanted to use a different font -- you could just change your CSS file, and that would change the footer on all of the linked pages. It's a lot faster that way, especially if you have a lot of pages.

Notice that I also added a couple of fonts as choices in the style sheet instructions -- font-family: arial, helvetica, sans-serif.

The reason why I did this was in case the person's computer didn't have that type of font. The browser would use the first one listed, and if that isn't on the computer, it would use the next one, and if that isn't on the computer, then the next one.

Anyway, I was able to use CSS to make the footer shorter, and less complicated, and still add a feature to it.

And that's an example of what I mean by making your code more simple. :)

JGIRL

18-05-2003, 09:20/09:20AM

Whew!

I understand what you mean now, thank you so much.
I will put focus on doing that and learn. I guess I do have alot of jumbo in there still :-))

I will also check out the site you gave as well. Thanks again for your help!

bragadocchio

18-05-2003, 11:03/11:03AM

You're welcome, Julie.

Just keep on doing what you're doing. The stuff that you learn how to do on this web site will be the stuff that you don't have to learn for the next one. :)

Your skills and knowledge will grow. I mentioned the stuff about trying to keep you pages simple because there's often more than one way to do things, and often the simpler way can be as effective as a more complicated method.

But, you're getting there. Keep it up!

JGIRL

18-05-2003, 11:14/11:14AM

Just like what they always say,
KISS

:-))

Thanks for the support!